Comments on: Nicola Barker: Darkmans http://booklit.com/blog/2007/10/03/nicola-barker-darkmans/ a literary handout Thu, 17 May 2012 10:14:00 +0000 http://wordpress.org/?v=2.2.2 By: Darn http://booklit.com/blog/2007/10/03/nicola-barker-darkmans/#comment-32289 Darn Wed, 22 Feb 2012 03:26:20 +0000 http://booklit.com/blog/2007/10/03/nicola-barker-darkmans/#comment-32289 SM and occy hit the nail on the head. And when they do the reasons why Barker chose the forms and elements that she did for this opus really crystallize: long, rambling, obscure, verbose, dead ending and maybe even pointless. SM and occy forgot to mention that the book is also a lot about language and it's relationship to history, thought, communication and ultimately our very society. The fluidness and impermanence of it can be enough to turn our very minds on their ends. Do we think with words? If we do, what does it mean then if the meanings of the words are unstable? What I just tried to illustrate leads you directly to what SM and occy are saying. There is no meaning. There cannot be. History prevents it. I think the ghost of Scoggin and the way he makes the characters language sometimes all muddled is one of the more important devices that Barker uses to illustrate this. SM and occy hit the nail on the head. And when they do the reasons why Barker chose the forms and elements that she did for this opus really crystallize: long, rambling, obscure, verbose, dead ending and maybe even pointless.

SM and occy forgot to mention that the book is also a lot about language and it’s relationship to history, thought, communication and ultimately our very society. The fluidness and impermanence of it can be enough to turn our very minds on their ends. Do we think with words? If we do, what does it mean then if the meanings of the words are unstable? What I just tried to illustrate leads you directly to what SM and occy are saying. There is no meaning. There cannot be. History prevents it.

I think the ghost of Scoggin and the way he makes the characters language sometimes all muddled is one of the more important devices that Barker uses to illustrate this.

]]> By: Rax http://booklit.com/blog/2007/10/03/nicola-barker-darkmans/#comment-31394 Rax Wed, 08 Dec 2010 21:29:21 +0000 http://booklit.com/blog/2007/10/03/nicola-barker-darkmans/#comment-31394 Well thank goodness for that. I've ended up on this website because having finished Darkmans yesterday, I was looking around the internet trying to find out what it was actually about. I'm glad to see I'm not the only one! Well thank goodness for that. I’ve ended up on this website because having finished Darkmans yesterday, I was looking around the internet trying to find out what it was actually about. I’m glad to see I’m not the only one!

]]> By: KevinfromCanada http://booklit.com/blog/2007/10/03/nicola-barker-darkmans/#comment-21451 KevinfromCanada Mon, 23 Feb 2009 15:58:25 +0000 http://booklit.com/blog/2007/10/03/nicola-barker-darkmans/#comment-21451 An interesting idea that I did try, Stewart. I was interested enough in <i> Darkmans </i> that I tried <i>Behindlings</i> to see if maybe Barker's approach worked better in a different book. Alas, all the weakneses were there and perhaps even worse -- and in the 150 pages I read before giving up there were none of the strengths. I can understand why some people are very keen on her (occy's post offers an indication of what might delight some readers, although not me) and until I see something that would cause me to change my mind I'm just going to conclude that she is not my kind of writer. An interesting idea that I did try, Stewart. I was interested enough in Darkmans that I tried Behindlings to see if maybe Barker’s approach worked better in a different book. Alas, all the weakneses were there and perhaps even worse — and in the 150 pages I read before giving up there were none of the strengths. I can understand why some people are very keen on her (occy’s post offers an indication of what might delight some readers, although not me) and until I see something that would cause me to change my mind I’m just going to conclude that she is not my kind of writer.

]]> By: Stewart http://booklit.com/blog/2007/10/03/nicola-barker-darkmans/#comment-21432 Stewart Mon, 23 Feb 2009 11:08:29 +0000 http://booklit.com/blog/2007/10/03/nicola-barker-darkmans/#comment-21432 I think there's a need to revisit Nicola Barker in shorter form, just to see if it's me (well, <em>us</em>!) or her. <em>Darkmans</em> has really put me off ever wanting to do so. I think there’s a need to revisit Nicola Barker in shorter form, just to see if it’s me (well, us!) or her. Darkmans has really put me off ever wanting to do so.

]]> By: KevinfromCanada http://booklit.com/blog/2007/10/03/nicola-barker-darkmans/#comment-21393 KevinfromCanada Sun, 22 Feb 2009 16:49:25 +0000 http://booklit.com/blog/2007/10/03/nicola-barker-darkmans/#comment-21393 I'm glad Mat made this post -- I haven't seen Stewart's review of this book and it offered a great chance to visit it. I share Stewart's opinion. I read Darkmans to the end and was not really entranced by it. I do think that occy's post explains the purpose of the book -- and also why I ultimately found it not worthwhile. I can appreciate that some people may find "there is no truth" to be the motivation for a good book. I don't. Having said that, I am glad that I struggled through the book and I don't really fault the critics who raved over it. I just don't agree with them. I’m glad Mat made this post — I haven’t seen Stewart’s review of this book and it offered a great chance to visit it. I share Stewart’s opinion. I read Darkmans to the end and was not really entranced by it. I do think that occy’s post explains the purpose of the book — and also why I ultimately found it not worthwhile. I can appreciate that some people may find “there is no truth” to be the motivation for a good book. I don’t. Having said that, I am glad that I struggled through the book and I don’t really fault the critics who raved over it. I just don’t agree with them.

]]> By: Mat Todd http://booklit.com/blog/2007/10/03/nicola-barker-darkmans/#comment-21369 Mat Todd Sun, 22 Feb 2009 02:57:44 +0000 http://booklit.com/blog/2007/10/03/nicola-barker-darkmans/#comment-21369 How nice to see a site where people aren't falling over themselves with how great this book is. I read a lot, and am a huge fan of classic and contemporary fiction. Darkmans blows, and is the first book in a long time I regret reading. It needed only 200 pages to convey a very nice idea. It would have been great with all the endless pedestrian first-draft guff cut out of the middle. It felt like I was stuck in the company of some dull people and I couldn't escape - they just kept on talking and talking and talking and oh my god. I don't blame Nicola Barker at all. She can clearly write very well, and I am not an author. I blame the ecstatic critics who are obviously in love with her and can forgive her an unnecessary 600 pages or so. How nice to see a site where people aren’t falling over themselves with how great this book is. I read a lot, and am a huge fan of classic and contemporary fiction. Darkmans blows, and is the first book in a long time I regret reading. It needed only 200 pages to convey a very nice idea. It would have been great with all the endless pedestrian first-draft guff cut out of the middle. It felt like I was stuck in the company of some dull people and I couldn’t escape - they just kept on talking and talking and talking and oh my god. I don’t blame Nicola Barker at all. She can clearly write very well, and I am not an author. I blame the ecstatic critics who are obviously in love with her and can forgive her an unnecessary 600 pages or so.

]]> By: Stewart http://booklit.com/blog/2007/10/03/nicola-barker-darkmans/#comment-9277 Stewart Tue, 24 Jun 2008 20:33:22 +0000 http://booklit.com/blog/2007/10/03/nicola-barker-darkmans/#comment-9277 Thanks, occy. I got rid of my copy last week, as it happens, so can't look back over that passage. Your quote certainly answers some things for me, especially since it's been so long and I look back on the book in bewilderment, and this paragraph comes fresh to me. Even with that help, I still doubt I'll ever see the book as enjoyable - I think I was made to dislike it...from the start...after a very small dose. Thanks, occy. I got rid of my copy last week, as it happens, so can’t look back over that passage. Your quote certainly answers some things for me, especially since it’s been so long and I look back on the book in bewilderment, and this paragraph comes fresh to me. Even with that help, I still doubt I’ll ever see the book as enjoyable - I think I was made to dislike it…from the start…after a very small dose.

]]> By: occy http://booklit.com/blog/2007/10/03/nicola-barker-darkmans/#comment-9272 occy Tue, 24 Jun 2008 14:58:18 +0000 http://booklit.com/blog/2007/10/03/nicola-barker-darkmans/#comment-9272 the 'answer' you all seek is on page 824: "the truth is that there is no truth. life is just a series of coincidences, accidents and random urges which we carefully forge - for our own, sick reasons - into a convenient design. everything is arbitrary. only art exists to make the arbitrary congeal. not memory or god or love, even. only art. the truth is simply an idea, a structure which we employ - in very small doses - to render life bearable. it's just a convenient mechanism, that's all." and then the rest of the conversation ... the ‘answer’ you all seek is on page 824: “the truth is that there is no truth. life is just a series of coincidences, accidents and random urges which we carefully forge - for our own, sick reasons - into a convenient design. everything is arbitrary. only art exists to make the arbitrary congeal. not memory or god or love, even. only art. the truth is simply an idea, a structure which we employ - in very small doses - to render life bearable. it’s just a convenient mechanism, that’s all.” and then the rest of the conversation …

]]> By: Stewart http://booklit.com/blog/2007/10/03/nicola-barker-darkmans/#comment-5936 Stewart Mon, 14 Apr 2008 08:57:09 +0000 http://booklit.com/blog/2007/10/03/nicola-barker-darkmans/#comment-5936 Hi, Pamela. At least you appear to have got more out of it than I think I ever would...even on rereading (which I'm never going to do). I just couldn't get beyond how <em>annoying</em> the whole book was. Hi, Pamela. At least you appear to have got more out of it than I think I ever would…even on rereading (which I’m never going to do). I just couldn’t get beyond how annoying the whole book was.

]]> By: Pamela http://booklit.com/blog/2007/10/03/nicola-barker-darkmans/#comment-5931 Pamela Mon, 14 Apr 2008 00:14:05 +0000 http://booklit.com/blog/2007/10/03/nicola-barker-darkmans/#comment-5931 The novel has a touch of comic genius, to be sure. But it also both arch, and sentimental: it questions the Oprah-psychobabble age (as most hip contemporary authors do), but also, when convenient, has its share of warm moments. For example: the father/son reconciliation (or near-reconciliation), the drug dealer who really just needed more attention from his dad. Barker wants it both ways. The novel has a touch of comic genius, to be sure. But it also both arch, and sentimental: it questions the Oprah-psychobabble age (as most hip contemporary authors do), but also, when convenient, has its share of warm moments. For example: the father/son reconciliation (or near-reconciliation), the drug dealer who really just needed more attention from his dad. Barker wants it both ways.

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